THE Barotse Royal Establishment (BRE) has disowned and distanced itself from the two groups calling for the restoration of the 1964 Barotse Agreement (BA).
Induna Mubonda speaking on behalf of the royal establishment said the BRE recognises the Government of President Rupiah Banda.
Induna Mubonda in a telephone interview with the Times from Mongu yesterday said though they had heard of the movements of people calling for the restoration of the Barotse Agreement, the establishment was not in any way involved.
“The BRE doesn’t operate like that, we have heard about those movements just like you have heard but we are not in any way involved because we operate according to the law,” he said.
Movement for the Restoration of the Barotse Agreement (MOREBA) chairperson Mutugulu Wanga said in Lusaka yesterday that the movement has been formed to ensure that the 1964 Agreement is restored.
“There is no way an agreement can be brought to an end without consulting the other party and that is what the Zambian Government has done,” he said.
When told that the BRE had disowned his organisation, Mr Wanga said he would only comment extensively after consulting with the Kuta (the BRE Council).
Another group calling itself the Barotse Freedom Movement (BFM) in a statement claimed that they would not be deterred from fighting for the restoration of the Barotse Agreement.
“The BFM shall not halt or be deterred in its campaign to sensitise the Barotse masses to resist and reject the illegal hold and occupation of the Barotseland by Zambia; following the abrogation of the Barotseland Agreement of 1964. BFM will not be intimidated,” reads an unsigned statement in part.
On Saturday police dispersed an illegal rally organised by the same groups that are agitating for the restoration of the Barotse Agreement.
Western Province police chief Peacewell Mweemba however said peace had since been restored in Mongu.
[Times of Zambia]
This agreement has dragged on for far too long. Many Zambians dont know the contents of this agreement and what it entails. For the benefit of the nation and to allow people comment /contribute to the debate from an informed position, can this agreement be published in full? i think it will then be fair to all.
the current litunga and the current bra are a sell out and have betrayed the people of western province. the receive bribes from the government and they ignore the poverty and lack of development that inflict their people. i want to assure the two movements that is moreba and bfm that we the people of barotse land are behind you and will suport you through to the end. this one zambia one nation nonsense has not done the people of western province any good. the people of western province have been very loyal to this one zambia one nation but the people of western province have been betrayed by all the governments that have ruled this country. it must be understood that these calls by bfm and moreba, are long over due, and must be suppported by all true and loyal barotses.
bulozi buyoyange
We “The Lozi Internet Party” demand independence and the Litunga says No!
We are very disappointed. Litunga, whaz up?
COUNTRYMEN YES LET THE GOVT., PUBLISH THE AGREEMENT. I THINK IT IS NOT A HIDDEN DOCUMENT. THOSE THAT HAVE IT COME UP WITH A WEB SITE AND POST IT THERE FOR ALL TO READ. KK IS AROUND & OTHER ARCHITECHTS OF THE SAME, SO NO NEED TO BEAT ABOUT THE BUSH, LET IT BE PUBLISHED SO THAT THIS ISSUE CAN BE PUT TO REST ONCE AND FOR ALL. IT’S STALE AND KEEPS POPPING UP LEAVING MOST OF US CONFUSED ON WHAT WAS AGREED.
#2, There will be a lot of employment opportunities created by Lozis vacating their jobs in Zambia to go back to “Barotseland”. But God forbid, the majority of us Lozis are not hotheads and empty tins like you and your colleagues. We have a lot going for us as Zambia and not as Barotseland.
The Barotse Agreement issue has been their for some time but why has it come in its current form now? It should be noted that the recent pronouncements by some catholic priests in Western Province have watered some fertile die hard secessionists’ minds who hard otherwise thought had no support. To make matters worse some irresponsible political leaders for petty political expedience supported the priests.This issue is likely to bring about a civil war if not condemned from the onset. Even the opposition political leaders who have supported the irresponsible priest will not be able to govern this country in peace if at all they come to power with secessionists looming in their backyard. Come on Zambians lets look at a bigger picture here. There are people who are pushing some agenda.
I thot this nonsense died a natural death.
My wife was telling me yesterday,that I will soon be married to a foreigner and expatriate(she s Lozi).Oh and my baby girls will have dual citizenship.
If the BRE has distanced itself then what is the state waiting for before it winds up these chaps for execution?How else can one commit treason if this is not a treasonable act?
“Induna Mubonda speaking on behalf of the royal establishment said the BRE recognises the Government of President Rupiah Banda.”
Doesn’t anyone find it strange that he can’t say “Government of the Republic of Zambia”?
#8 VJ Rigger, stitch me up, you have craked my ribs we. ala wandepula. Those of us who have bought land in Kalabo, where my wife hails from will need Visas in our retirement age! :d:x in the sovereign state.
# 8 that funny,This whole thing is just a past time for bored frustrated failed politicians.Everybody knows that tyhe whole damn thing cant work
one zambia one nation. i thought this is what we have been all preaching. can someone publish this agreement for us. otherwise we have no right to comment or KK can tell us more….
#8 continued….
These secessionist sentiments are creeping in my home.Its not only GRZ affected,I and many others may lose out if this is allowed.I urge GRZ to smoke out these Bfm etc.use rocket propelled grenades,scud missiles or pellet guns if possible.
No. 10. uliwanzelu ai. i did not notice that. so it could be that they are just afraid of the wrath of RB. someone must explain this to us. I think most of our young generation have no idea whatever its under the carpet…
THE FACT THAT THIS VERY IMPORTANT AGREEMENT HAS BEEN BLACKOUT EVEN FROM OUR CIVIC EDUCATION AND HISTORY SYLLABUS AND CONSTITUITION CONFIRMS THAT THEIR IS BLACKMAIL FORM THE GOVERNMENT SIDE. THE CURRENT LITUNGA IS JUST A BUSINESS MAN AND CANNOT BE TRUSTED TO STAND FOR THE PEOPLE. KK SPEARHEADED THE SLOGAN OF ONE ZAMBIA ONE NATION BECAUSE HE KNEW RIGHT FROM THE BEGINNING THAT NORTHERN RHODESIA AND BATROTSE LAND MERGED TO BE CALLED ZAMBIA. ONE NEEDS TO BE ON THE GROUND IN SOME PARTS OF THE PROVINCE TO UNDERSTAND WHY PEOPLE WANT TO SECESSED, AFTER ALL THEY HAVE THE RIGHT TO DO SO. THOSE NIGGAS WHO DONT HAVE KOWLEDGE OF THE CONTENTS OF THIS AGREEMENTS SHOULD SHUT THEIR BEAKS COZ THEY DONT KNOW ANYTING. NEVER DOUBT ABOUT THE CAPACITY OF THE BAROSELAND TO SUSTAIN ITSELF COZ LEWANIKA HAD A…
You Lozis are so myiopic, you want to claim a relatioship with UK, Denmark, USA and Botswana when you fail to claim a relationship with your close neighbours. The Litunga was compromised if you dont know, the Commissioner who made the Litunga sign that dubious agreement with UK had hidden and private selfish motive to get wealth from other parts of Zambia thats why he was claiming for land that wasnt even under the Litunga. The UK doesnt even recognise that agreement signed by a selfish individual after duping the Litunga. At that time Barotseland was not even beyond Mongu. Can you be honest enough and tell me that Barosteland icludes Copperbelt, Livinstone, parts of Katanga etc
Nalu @ #16, please look down to the left side of your keyboard. You may notice that the third button from the bottom reads “Caps Lock.” Kindly hit this button with your left index finger. Using all caps is like shouting; and you should not be shouting. No noise please. If you can’t fix your keyboard, please put on your hearing aid. Thank You.
The Litunga of Barotseland, acting after consultation with his Council, shall be authorised and empowered to make laws for Barotseland in relation to the following matters, that is to say-
(a) The Litungaship;
(b) The authority at present known as the Barotse Native Government (which shall hereafter be known as the Barotse Government);
(c) The authorities at present known as Barotse Native Authorities;
(d) The courts at present known as Barotse Native Courts;
(e) The status of the members of the Litunga’s Council;
(f) matters relating to local government;
(g) land;
(h) forests;
(i) traditional and customary matters relating to Barotseland alone;
(j) fishing;
(k) control of hunting;
(l) game preservation;
(m) control of bush fires;
The List Goes On….. Want some more?
@#18 Moderator
Thumbs up!
Lozi stupidity at its best, now the fight looks to be within. I don’t want to be Lozi anymore, i love you Induna Mubonda and BRE. To hell with the Movement for the Restoration of the Barotse Agreement (MOREBA) and Barotse Freedom Movement (BFM). Im for one Zambia one nation.
# 18 hahaha
I have read the agreement and what is listed at #19 is only part of it. Unfortunately there is also the matter of a serious historical mistake where the Muzungus thought the Litunga’s territory included the whole of Northwestern province, parts of copperbelt and central province, as well as part of Angola and the Caprivi. So they erroneously got permission to mine copper from the Litunga! Fact is they are not just making noise about Western province, but what I have itemised. I hope they are all arrested for treason and we continue to live in peace. This is nonsense.
can we discuss this agreement now, disowning your own people is very poor leadership.
MODERATOR #18 PLEASE GO FOR A BRAIN SCAN. IF YOU READ AND UNDERSTOOD THE POINTS RAISED WHAT THE HELL IS WRONG WITH CAPS LOCK . IF YOU HAVE NOTHING TO CONTRIBUTE PLEASE ZIP IT UP!. I’M NOT THE FIRST ONE TO USE CAPS LOCK KEYS CHECK # 4.BY THE WAY WHAT DO YOU KNOW ABOUT THE KEYBOARD.
Now I cant bear it any more..lozis just own up to your useless day dream. Never will it happen in this time and age that your Litunga will be your president within Zambia. Never till Jesus comes.
So , on this RB I support you, can you quickly send the komandos to flush out these two useless rebel goups?? arrest them and send them to mukobeko..they are committing treason.
Useless frusrated people …basuga them, machine gun them, scud misle them and lastly flaten their hiding places. Useless insipid rebels.
these are results of careless talk from a supposed clergy man. what the Bishop of Mongu did say has potetntial to ignite such kind of action from opportunists. its a pity that some people were actually urging the Bishop on. we have only one zambia
How can you come up just like that and say you want to secede? Have they had a plebiscite for all people included in the agreement such as the Nkoyas, Kaondes, Lambas, Lenjes, Ilas amongst others to see whether they want to be part of Zambia or not? As for Western province being marginalised and poor – hello! – Zambia is a poor country. The only provinces in Zambia that are not poor are Copperbelt and Lusaka. Northern province has no industry to speak of. North-West is only coming up now. Luapula has one of the highest incidence of blindness in the country partly due to the diet that is deficient in vitamin A. Big swathes of Eastern, Southern, and Central province also dont have roads.
Here is part of the agreement in question:
(1) The Northern Rhodesia Government does not wish to derogate from any of the powers exercised by the Litunga and Council in respect of land matters under customary law and practice.
(2) The Northern Rhodesia Government would like to ensure that the provision of public services and the responsibility of economic development in Barotseland are not hampered by special formalities.
(3) The Northern Rhodesia Government recognises and agrees that full consultation should take place with the Litunga and Council before any land in Barotseland is used for public purposes or in the general interests of economic development.
(4) The position regarding land in Barotseland in an independent Northern Rhodesia should ,therefore, be as follows:-
(a) There…
Blog Archive
? 2010 (17)
? October (1) THE CHRONOLOGICAL HISTORY OF THE LOZI LITUNGASHIP…
? September (2) WISDOM FROM PRINCE KUSIYO MBIKUSITA LEWANIKAPROFESSOR SIMENDA TELLS OFF THE POST ON BAROTSELAN…
? August (2) VENN,ZAIN GAIN?BAROTSE ROYAL ESTABLISHMENT SUBMISSION TO THE ZAMB…
? June (6) CORPORATE DUO-UNION MEMBERSHIP WRANGLESMY MANUAL OF STEREO-TYPING NATIONALITIESBAROTSELAND’S MISMANAGED INFRASTRUCTUREGREAT BAROTSELAND (GB)THE REAL CAUSE OF THE ISRAELI RAID ON A GAZA BOUND…SOUTH AFRICA 2010 – WILL AFRICAN FOOTBALL COME OF …
? March (2) BAROTSELAND -THE CASE FOR PIZO.BAROTSELAND’S MISMANAGED INFRASTRUCTURE
? February (3) Should Bemba /Nyanja be the only ‘National’ Langua…’JUS AD BELLUM’ – BY DECEPTION THOU SHALT DO WAR I…MY MANUAL OF STEREO-TYPING…
do we know how far Shoprite mongu is situated from centre of town? about 2km. this is how far the locals wanted it to be. and it took so many years of lobbying for the group to secure that peice of land. now paul duffy should come and say that lozis have been marginalised…
Why are we lozis complaining about development in our province. how many MPs, are lozis why dont they take development to their constituencies? Even the speaker for the law making instution in zambia has been lozi for a long time. we need to learn to be less selfish, that way our province will develop.A lot of rich lozis could have invested in barotse bu since we do not even trust ourselves we choose to invest in other provinces. The world is becoming global, there are a lot of us lozis in the diaspora and it is amazing how multicultural the world has become. How then can we harbour so much anger against other tribes. Those agreemens will take us bacwards and not forward. What prevents AKA from investing in kwa haye.
I will have no problem with this agreement if boundaries just stick to Western province, but still those people of western should have the right to choose where they want to belong, and not their leaders. They should even conduct a referendum where majority should win. This should be done according to towns, say if Kalabo or Sesheke does not want to belong to Barotseland their rights should be respected because no one has the right to choose where people should belong. I just feel pity for companies like Zambia Sugar who depend on Nyengos from Kalabo for cutting canes, because when western province becomes a state all these will have to be needing visas to get to our beloved zambia for such Jobs, and am sure Nyengos will not accept this move, which leaves only Mongu to b onlyBarotseland
Politics Politics again and again
Lozis just stick to your western territories, do not touch areas which are not yours anyway like North-western, parts of central, parts of the Copperbelt, and even parts of Southern because this is a non- starter as far as am concerned. These people will not accept to speak Silozi, under their feet!.
#30 you are right, Lozis should identify what makes the province poor. I have a Lozi friend who says though him and his wife are Lozis they cannot take their kids to western province because there is too much witchcraft, hence they would rather settle on the Copperbelt.
# 16 if you dont know your own history its better you ask. Ki hande ku fita kuiswabisa tate. Y’all should read up on British Relations with the Litungas and how Barotseland became a protectorate, how it was sovereign. If the Barotse agreement of 1964 did not provide for Barotse to be sovereign why is there so much darkness and Silence on this agreement by the govt? Litunga wa saba kakuli hana support hande and he knows his domain is dependent on RB’s administration. I’m not a secessionist but I’m saying let Govt come out clear on this issue and let the unaltered barotse agreement be published. Kwanda cwalo taba ye haina ku shwa. Ikana izuhanga ona cwana nako ni nako.
#33 if you read your history you will see that ‘Barotseland’ embraced all those regions you mentioned and I’m sure thats the Barotseland dealt with in the 1964 agreement. Its the KK govt which cut down the Litunga’s domain.
FINALLY, SENSE HAS PREVAILED. STOP EMBARRASSING WESTERN PROVINCE. EVERYBODY IN ZAMBIA IS NOW SO CONNECTED TO EVERYBODY ELSE SUCH THAT TALKING ABOUT SEPARATION IS LIKE ASKING TO TAKE THE HEART OUT AND LET THE BODY CONTINUE LIVING. SOME OF US HAVE RELATIVES IN ALMOST EVERY PROVINCE. THANK YOU LITUNGA. THAT IS WHY WE LOVE YOU!!
KAPELWA THE ENLIGHTENED ONE – I hear what you are saying completely. But don’t you think that the best way to resolve this matter is for the two movements and all their supporters to raise money and take government to court. The fact that we are all not after secession means that we should find a more progressive way of resolving the issue. Who the Lozis have a tiff with is the government for continously ignoring the Agreement. Kono there is a Lozi saying that haiba situwa sanela you don’t tear down the whole house, you just mend where the roof is leaking. Isn’t that the best wisom? Nji mukulwange???
#37 thats a lame excuse. ‘Everybody in Zambia is so connected’ pah! everybody was so connected when the colonialists drew the boredrs in Africa. they literally divided tribes and villages in two. Who says if Barotse becomes sovereign then only Lozi’s will be granted citizenship? Lets just honor agreements, period!
#37 thats a lame excuse. ‘Everybody in Zambia is so connected’ pah! everybody was so connected when the colonialists drew the borders in Africa. they literally divided tribes and villages in two. Who says if Barotse becomes sovereign then only Lozi’s will be granted citizenship? Lets just honor agreements, period!
The Jackal my point is that if such an agreement exists it should be honoured. taking the govt to court? I dont think it would work. I have my skepticisms about it.
#40 Yes we can honor the agreement first by including all the peoples whose territories are included in the agreement. You cant have it both ways. There is no way that the people of NW, Central, Copperbelt, and Southern will agree to be ruled by the Litunga. Also, dont forget this is also an international issue. I dont see the governments of Namibia, Angola,Botswana, Zimbabwe and DRC supporting the secession of Barotseland from Zambia because of a number of issues one of which is related to the usage of water from the Zambezi as well as the implications for their own territorial integrity. The situation in the Niger delta or South Sudan is different because the resources in those areas gives the people concerned a bargaining chip. As it stands Barotseland has nothing.
One of the reasons the British wanted to sign a treaty with the Litunga was not because they loved the Lozi people so much but to have access to the minerals that they thought they would find in the Kingdom. If those minerals were there, then why did they not invest in the territory in the same manner they did in Copperbelt province? Instead WP became a labour reserve for both the Zambian and the South African mines. There was a thriving teak industry at some point from which the BRE got paid royalties. What they did with the money nobody knows.
Barotse agreement or none, people have co-existed in and out of the province. Even before 1969 you had administrators, teachers, policemen, students studying at now Kambule Secondary school from other provinces, similarly you had Lozis’ doing the same in other parts of the Country. Lozis’ did not start marrying across other tribes after independence and it is also not true that people from other provinces are not allowed to settle in Western Province, there was even a famous shop of Bo Soko near suburbs in Mongu who originated from East. It is a pity that because of these developments the province is being painted in negative light. Maybe that is why some people feel so strongly that we are not needed after all. When you find comments such as a Lozi will never be President of Zambia!!
There has misinformation on what the province has to offer. The plain is the womb of the Zambezi river, where it bursts its’ banks during rain season, resulting in off-flow of the tastiest fish you’ve ever come across. Other products that grow very well are as follows; rice, maize, cassava, sweet potatoes, cashew nuts “The late Zambia Airways” used to serve Cashew Nuts on board grown in this province, Sorghum, Millet. We have beef which Zambeef relies upon for its supplies. The plains is also home to variety of bird life and tortoise some which are extremely delicious. We have the Liuwa game reserve a great attraction. To crown in all every year we have the spectacular Kuomboka Ceremony, after the Ceremony you can settle down and enjoy the local brew sipeso, maheu mbote made from…
There has misinformation on what the province has to offer. The plain is the womb of the Zambezi river, where it bursts its’ banks during rain season, resulting in off-flow of the tastiest fish you’ve ever come across. Other products that grow very well are as follows; rice, maize, cassava, sweet potatoes, cashew nuts “The late Zambia Airways” used to serve Cashew Nuts on board grown in this province, Sorghum, Millet. We have beef which Zambeef relies upon for its supplies. The plains is also home to variety of bird life and tortoise some which are extremely delicious. We have the Liuwa game reserve a great attraction. To crown in all every year we have the spectacular Kuomboka Ceremony, you can settle down and enjoy the local brew sipeso, maheu mbote made from honey.
We shall send our crack squad to barotse to deal with this issue once and for all. Those cowards calling for secession are just bored peasants. Let them concentrate on drinking kachipembe and Sipesu.
The Nkoya people and other tribes in Western Province, who are not Lozi, will NEVER allow their Province to be subdivided and handed over to a few disillusioned individuals including the Litunga. They are happy to be part of Zambia.
Even the Litunga knows that deep down, the barotse nonsense will never happen that is why the BRE have distanced themselves from those groups who are trying to bring up this outdated political scandal.
The Nkoya people have faith in the Government of the Republic of Zambia in terms of bringing developments to all districts in Western Province. It has already started to happen and it is only a matter of time before districts like Kaoma (formerly known as Ma Nkoya district before 1964) will become a provincial power house in itself. May God Bless Zambia.
one Zambia, one nation ba fikala…..
@#41Kapelwa The Enlightened one
If you cannot take GRZ to court,then stop whining like spoilt orphans.I think these secessionists need to grow up accept the current status quo,exert this energy of secession to wealth creation in the province.
These chiefdoms should have been abolished at independence.They are just a nuisense now with all those ceremonies, witchcraft and “border” in-fights. Can anybody really say what developments these chiefdoms have brought? Now they beg the govt to repair their “palaces” or buy them vehicles !
Apologies for duplicate message. The province has a lot to offer and this in on top of the untapped mineral resources and oil. We thank God for Bulozi and we will develop and ensure we prosper accordingly to shame the critics. Ha Naha Yende Yee! The committed few can turn around situation and others will follow.
#36 KK was right to cut down the Litunga’s domain because the move was illegally obtained and the people in those territories were not for the ideal, so better stick to what is yours than claiming other people’s land. Lozis are just 7% in zambia population hence under my food can you afford to take even quatre of our land. KK was right not to allow this dubious move to take place because it was to cause arnachy in zambia. Lozis just stick to your sand, very soon am replacing prof. Lungwangwa who is to be sent back to the plains where they are forming a new country.
VJ RIGGER – I’m with you. How I wish all this negative energy could instead be channelled to developing the province.
HISTORIAN – Are you Nkoya? When you say ‘other tribes who are not Lozi?’ Who is Lozi? Sometimes we should comment soberly and not emotionally. If a Nkoya is not Lozi, then everybody in Western Province is not Lozi – and actually that is the truth. Barosteland is a collection of tribes which were conquered by the Kololo who then imposed this language we are now speaking called Lozi. The Litunga has his own tribe. In Lealui they speak a unique language. You should be educating other people and not add to ignorance. Emotions won’t take you anywhere. The truth is that without the national influence of the Litunga other small tribes would be suffering, including the…
thats right Jackal. Malozi is a generic term applied to about 32 tribes. And Kanguya you should read more. Where do you get your statistics that the Lozi are only 7% of Zambia? Zambia has 72 tribes and about 32 of those are Lozi tribes. See just how big a factor we are?
One Zambia one nation.No barriers should separate the people of zambia in the name of any agreement. lozies we love you and let us live as one family. No barotsoland for the lozies but for the ZAMBIANS of all the provinces
No 54
The Nkoya language is very different to Lozi the spoken language, that is one obvious fact. The Nkoya people also do not subscribe to the notion that every tribe in Western Province should be known as a Lozi just because we happen to be in the same province. You are the chaps spreading lies and false propaganda. This is why even the government can not honor the barotse nonsense because they would have to give the Nkoya people their own agreement which just complicates things. One Zambia One Nation.
#54 Many Nkoyas dont see themseleves as being part of the Bulozi kingdom and that is why some of them have been advocating for the formation of a new province called Kafue. If you go to youtube you can see the Kathanga ceremony performed by the Nkoyas where their various leaders get together for thanks giving. Other ethnic groups may have submitted to the authority of the Litunga but with the Nkoya that is somewhat disputed. There have even been calls by some Nkoyas for their language to be used in schools in the Kaoma area as opposed to Silozi.
Am told this fracas was as a result of fishermen who do not agree to government ban on catching fish smaller than 2 inches something like nothinh to doe with barosi agreement off course that balozi agreement is fraiuled in many ways and would be extremely difficult to impose on other tribes and regions………
#54 Kapelwa The Enlightened one . At the moment you are shooting at wrong targets. Your Chief Litunga has distanced himself from your organisations and its motives,he is the one you must be advising(shooting) on the matter so that you achieve your intended go. Most of us from other tribes are just worried that you guys will bring civil soon. One thing l would like to know is how you will pay back for the resources you have benefited from which do not originate from your said ‘state’. The government is also busy with some big projects in your’state’,why didnt you advise them not to go ahead as you will have to do it yourselves later?
Hmm despite all the emotions flying around here i can safely say i ve learnt quiet a great deal about what the Barotse agreement is all about. But in all fairness, and I stand to be corrected, seccesion isnt the best way to go about it. People might be attracted by a few seemingly attractive ideas they think could emanate out of such an action but this could be a very long and painfully protracted process which in the process can produce more harm than good. Lets say, for instance, seccesion is allowed, how much would be spent on just establishing proper power structures? And how willing would the people in the same so-called Barotse republic would willingly recognise the new govenment? And what could this establishment do which hasnt been done in the current set up?
Why are people so scared about this issue? Honestly the comment by RB at the airport enroute to chipata to have leaders of the two groups does not reflect good leadership. The behaviour of the people in Mongu over the weekend was a sign of being fed up in the sence that govt have never tried to hear the case to its conclusive end. RB should allow for dialogue with these people by first setting up a commission on this matter and all people make submission and find a way out. By arresting peolpe around will just bottle the problem even further. Infact this is the best time when KK and other senior people are still around. Let us continue eating from the same pot people.
#61 The new state would be a monarchy and the Litunga would be head of state. I am not sure whether it would be a constitutional monarchy like Lesotho or an absolute one like Swaziland.
Now that the Litunga has issued the Barotse Disagreement 2010, the earlier agreement should be redundant, save for historical reasons.
In addition, it is important to know that there is no tribe in Zambia called Lozi just like there is no tribe called Nyanja. These are names of languages. Do qualify your comments with say “Lozi speaking” people.
#63 thanks for the data. My concern still remains on how this same system would be established, how logn it would take to get up and running and if at all peace could be maintained in case some tribal groups or indeed just other people are not happy with the system. This could breed more confusion than the new state would have the capcity to handle. And history has it that African Monarchs are usually failed states. Look at Swaziland. Anyway, I personally think the people in western province are much better off just pushing for a fair share of development in their province rather than pursuing this potentially explosive route. And mind you the bazungus weer drawing up these agreements for their own good so we gotta be careful!
# 62 I can assure you NO government leader would want to waste his time on this issue. RB was right in his response and we the anti barotse agreement group support him.
#66 You are very correct. In fact the bazungus knew that Lewanika was exaggerating the extent of his territory but they wanted to have a document to stop the Belgians in claiming more land south of the Zambezi watershed as they thought that the land would abound in gold in the same quantities as on the reef in South Africa. I just think that before any sort of declaration to secede can be made, the people involved have to be given the chance to state their views. It would also be good if somebody would actually break down the mineral resources that are supposedly found in the province. I am of the opinion that if they had been there, then the British would have exploited them extensively as that was the whole purpose of the colonial foray into Africa.
im a lozi in support of the calls by bfm and morba, my advice to my fellow lozis blogging here today, is that these calls are not against any tribe or our current government , these calls are about us the people of western province wanting to rule ourselves, lets us therefore not call any tribe thieves. coz no single tribe in this country can claim not to have thieves among its people. bembas are our freinds some times even relatives although they dont like our language, we can never form any hatred against them. my advice to the lozi haters is that these calls we lozis are advocating for are not meant against any tribe or people but they are meant to find solutions to the many problems the people of western province are facing which the successive governments of this country have…
• the successive governments of this country have neglected to address. there is no need for any one on this blog to call any one a triballist or a thief, when you point at the other tribalist or thief count how many fingers are pointing at yourself. there is nothing xenophobic about what the lozis are calling for, but that is depend on how the government and the people of this country respond. we lozis have been very loyal to this one zambia one nation but we have been betrayed by the successive govts of this country and even up to now some tribes still fail to accept us as equal citizens of this country, how many times have you not heard some tribes including government officials saying no lozi will ever rule this country? should the presidence of this country be about certain tribes…
• should the presidence of this country be about certain tribes and not character of the person aspiring? are the lozis really tribal?, in 2001 lozis voted for mazoka and not inonge, in 2006 lozis voted for mwanawasa and not hh, are lozis tribal, the people who are tribal are those that call lozis as tribal. to those lozis who are against this cause, dont insult those of us that are loyal to our mother land. many of you are the so called lozis that have never even been to western province to know what is really happening and know nothing about our culture and heritage, you are even embarrassed to be called lozis, why dont change your names to other names of some tribe you feel confortable with, cause we proud and loyal lozis are many enough dont need you at all. bfm keep the fire burning
A divide and rule strategy has worked in many instances. Induna Mubonda did not say that the BRE is not sympathetic to the fate of the Barotseland Agreement. To the contrary, the BRE has been the agreement’s most ardent advocate. What Induna Mubonda said is that the BRE is a different entity from and uses different tactics from those used by either the MOREBA or the BFM. This does not amount to “disowning the secessionists.”
Indeed not everyone who is sympathetic to the fate of the Barotseland Agreement is a secessionist. If the Barotseland Agreement is devoid of legality, as some have advocated, then let its legality be challenged in a civilized fashion and thus nullify its terms. Otherwise, I am afraid to say that the Zambian government is not acting responsibly.
#67 “NO government leader would want to waste his time on this issue.” It’s such trivialization of issues that usually leads to unwarranted consequences. A stitch in time saves nine. No sensible leader will allow an issue of this magnitude to escalate. Fortunately, we are dealing with a document that was signed by representatives of three responsible nations.
We have seen in neighboring Zimbabwe, how the arrogance of one leader has led to the suffering of millions. Robert Mugabe trashed a similar document and his people bore the consequences for it. Mugabe had a right cause but errored in the method he used. The Zambian government may have the right cause but need not employ Robert Mugabe’s arrogance. Civilized as we claim to, we should be able to resolve an issue…
#67 “NO government leader would want to waste his time on this issue.” It’s such trivialization of issues that usually leads to unwarranted consequences. A stitch in time saves nine. No sensible leader will allow an issue of this magnitude to escalate. Fortunately, we are dealing with a document that was signed by representatives of three responsible nations.
We have seen in neighboring Zimbabwe, how the arrogance of one leader has led to the suffering of millions. Robert Mugabe trashed a similar document and his people bore the consequences for it. Mugabe had a right cause but errored in the method he used. The Zambian government may have the right cause but need not employ Robert Mugabe’s arrogance. Civilized as we claim to be, we should be able to resolve an issue amicably.
Time and again in Africa, bunches of lunatics arise claiming to liberate their tribes when in fact their activities are driven by selfish motivates and not the people they claim to defend. If the groups in WP are convinced that the agreement is legally binding and should be honored then they should take the legal route. If they engage in any forms of violence, let government deal with them decisively. We don’t want anarchy. There are already too many problems in Zambia.
If Lozis secede in my profession it is welcome, a lot of room for promotions. Let them go it will be a good riddance.
Why prosecute them, let them bugger off after all Lozi lanad is just a tiny part of Western province, they are thinking that they can claim colonial boundaries, they are duffty.
This is the work of some uneducated Lozis, the 21st Century Lozi Land is restricted from where the Nalikwanda sails from to Mongu Harbour period, can that make a country. Not even Lesotho or Swaziland.
#71 muntu pa muntu..”are the lozis really tribal? in 2001 lozis voted for mazoka and not Inonge “.. Point well-taken. Going by their voting pattern, Lozis are among the least tribal of any tribal grouping in Zambia and the Bembas the most tribal. Bembas are masters at smear tactics. What they are they smear on another tribe and cry foul the loudest.
During the time when there was a Bemba president, many of us non-Bembas felt like we were second class citizens. I dread the time when there will be another Bemba president… not because I hate Bembas, but because of what I and my people are likely to go through when that happens. If Zambia is indeed a unitary state, then why the saying: “No Lozi can ever be president of Zambia”? And if we thus so assert, why shouldn’t Lozis…
#75 Sugardaddy: “Time and again.., bunches of lunatics .. they should take the legal route”.
I would have thought that the BRE is Barotseland’s most authoritative representative and has for decades attempted to engage the Zambian government on this issue from a legal standpoint, albeit to no avail. Observed lunacy, if indeed present, is a product of such stand-off. The Zambian government is able and competent to engage the best of lawyers to fight and bring this matter to a close, if only it was willing.
The Botswana government displayed character when it agreed to go to court in a lawsuit brought against it by the Bushmen of the Kalahari. The Zambian government has not yet demonstrated that level of maturity and accoutability. In Zambia, it’s the law of the jungle that…
These Lozis are now becoming a nosense. Why wasting time on such trivial issues, Banda’s response was appropriete for them, there are so many ways of pushing issues than resorting to violence. Shame on you guys, find the best way to address your grievances. This tribe to be honest amaze me a lot the way they put there priorities. These are the same people who can hold a big dinner dance to fundraise for Kuomboka in a five star Hotel, Intercontinental to be precise, and at the same time say they are so poor, their people feed on Mangoes, shame. Even when there are floods and Lozis are suffering their leader Litunga can never visit the area. I really wonder that will happen when they become independent, only leaders will be enjoying the money, like what happens in Lesotho and…
People who would want to be ruled by a chief who wears COLONIAL SECURITY GUARD UNIFORM, when his fellow chiefs in zambia who are proud of their local materials wear home made. We know there is no single factory in Western province, but to be honest this chief means no good to our country.
Lozis amaze me a lot, just because they stayed with Francis Coilard a Scotsh they also had to copy the style of his clothes and named it Siziba. Please Lozis spare us your inferiority complex of copying whatever comes from a white person, some of us zambians are proud of who we are.
Why is Father Duffy quiet? Is this the change he is talking about?
Could this Barotse Agreement also be responsible for the obnoxious map that Zambia has where the Katangese sunk into Zambian territory thereby making it look like a fetus? I get so annoyed when I see how Congo eats into Zambian territory – because of minerals — where were we? Since I here the agreement also claims CB or parts thereof, was it the time that the boundary was demarcated?
this issue is a waste of brain power, why may i ask do people wish to be independent as if its going to improve anything, the fact is things would get worse if anything, hahahahahahahahahaha ati we want our own state, are you for fukin real, im a chewa, i also want my own state hahahahahahahahaha
Please read the copy and understand its simply a request to include the so called agreement in the Constitution.
LONDON
HER MAJESTY’S STATIONERY OFFICE
EIGHTPENCE NET
Cmnd.2366
THE BAROTSELAND AGREEMENT 1964
Following talks in London between the British Government, the Government of Northern Rhodesia and The Litunga of Barotseland; an Agreement regarding the position of Barotseland within independent Northern Rhodesia was concluded at the commonwealth Relations office on 18 th May, 1964. It is entitled, “The Barotseland Agreement 1964”. It was signed by Dr.K.D.Kaunda, Prime Minister of Northern Rhodesia, by Sir Mwanawina Lewanika III,K.B.E Litunga of Barotseland and by the Right Honourable Duncan Sandys M.P Secretary of State for common wealth Relations and for the colonies…
APPENDIX
THE BAROTSELAND AGREEMENT 1964
This Agreement is made this eighteenth day of May, 1964 between KENNETH DAVID KAUNDA, Prime Minister of Northern Rhodesia of the one part and SIR MWANAWINA LEWANIKA THE THIRD ,K.B.E., Litunga of Barotseland, acting on behalf of himself, his heirs and successors, his council, and the chiefs and people of Barotseland of the other party is signed by the Right Honourable Duncan Sandys, M.P Her Majesty’s principal secretary of state for common wealth relations and for the colonies, to signify the approval of her majesty’s government in the united kingdom of the arrangements entered into between the parties to this agreement and recorded therein.
Whereas it was proposed that the northern Rhodesia shall become an independent sovereign state to be…
And where as it is the wish of the government of northern Rhodesia and of the Litunga of Barotseland,his council and the chiefs and people of Barotseland that northern Rhodesia should proceed to independence as one country and that all its peoples should be one nation:
And where , as having regard to the fact that all treaties and other agreements subsisting between her majesty the queen of the United Kingdom of great Britain and northern Ireland and The Litunga of Barotseland will terminate when Northern Rhodesia becomes an independent sovereign republic and her majesty’s government in the United Kingdom will there upon cease to have any responsibility for the government of Rhodesia including Barotseland. It is the wish of the government of northern Rhodesia and of The Litunga of…
It is the wish of the government of northern Rhodesia and of The Litunga of Barotseland to enter into arrangements concerning the position of Barotseland as part of the republic of Zambia to the place of the treaties and other agreements hitherto subsisting between Her Majesty the Queen and The Litunga of Barotseland:
And whereas on the sixteenth day of April,1964 a provisional agreement was concluded at Lusaka with purpose and it is the desire of the government of northern Rhodesia and The Litunga, acting after consultation with his council to conclude a permanent agreement with this purpose:
NOW THIS AGREEMENT WITNESSETH and it is hereby agreed between the said Kenneth David Kaunda, Prime Minister of Northern Rhodesia, on behalf of the government of Northern Rhodesia and the said Sir…
1. Citation and commencement
This agreement may be cited as the Barotseland Agreement 1964 and shall come into force on the day on which Northern Rhodesia, including Barotseland, becomes the independent sovereign Republic of Zambia.
2. The Constitution of Zambia
The constitution of the republic of Zambia shall include the provisions agreed upon for the inclusion herein at the constitutional conference held in London in May, 1964 relating to:-
(a) the protection of human rights and fundamental freedoms of the individual;
(b) the judiciary; and
(c) the public service
and those provisions shall have full force and effect in Barotseland.
3. Administration of Justice
(1) Subject to the provisions of this Agreement, the people of Barotseland shall be accorded the same rights of access to the high court of the republic of Zambia as are accorded to other citizens of the Republic under the laws for the time being in force in the Republic and a judge or judges of the high court selected from among the judges who normally sit in Lusaka shall regularly proceed on circuit in Barotseland at each intervals as the due administration of justice may require.
(2) The people of Barotseland shall be accorded the same rights of appeal from the decisions of the courts of the Republic of Zambia as are accorded to other citizens of the Republic under the laws for the time being in force in the Republic.
4. The Litunga and His Council
(1) The government of the republic of Zambia will accord recognition as such to the person who ois for the time The Litunga of Barotseland under the customary law of Barotseland.
(2) The Litunga of Barotseland, acting after consultation with his Council as constituted for the time being under the customary law of Barotseland shall be the principal local authority for the government and administration of Barotseland.
A lot of discretion was granted to the Barotse including full retention of the Litunga’s powers over such things as land and the like. Why hasn’t this been honoured?
A lot of discretion was granted to the Barotse including full retention of the Litunga’s powers over such things as land and the like. Why hasn’t this agreement been honoured?
THE BAROTSELAND AGREEMENT 1964
THE BAROTSELAND
AGREEMENT 1964
Presented to parliament by the secretary for commonwealth relations by command of her majesty may 1964
LONDON
HER MAJESTY’S STATIONERY OFFICE
EIGHTPENCE NET
Cmnd.2366
THE BAROTSELAND AGREEMENT 1964
Following talks in London between the British Government, the Government of Northern Rhodesia and The Litunga of Barotseland; an Agreement regarding the position of Barotseland within independent Northern Rhodesia was concluded at the commonwealth Relations office on 18 th May, 1964. It is entitled, “The Barotseland Agreement 1964”. It was signed by Dr.K.D.Kaunda, Prime Minister of Northern Rhodesia, by Sir Mwanawina Lewanika III,K.B.E Litunga of Barotseland and by the Right Honourable Duncan Sandys M.P…
#Dogma998 you can narate to us and even talk as if you are preaching to a group of pagans, but our stance still remains the same, this agreement was illegal to say the least because you never consulted people in those territories e.g North-western province. At that time there were few educated people to read certain documents, then for you you had Francis Coilard who could interprate for you hence you wanted to take people on other territories for granted. Than God KK who believes in human rights never accepted it. This thing to be honest will never work until the people of this area learn to stick their boundaries only to western province, because countries like Namibia, Botswana, Zambabwe and even Mozambique cannot accept this scam. Better you stick to just Mongu your territory.
Lozis are the most selfish people, am sure even when they were planning for that scam, their subjects were not even consulted, only the top leadership had the information. Western province is a society where if you are not part of the leadership of even the elite, it means you are cursed to the least. The elite can do anything without consulting the poor subjects.
Now it makes sense ,” is that the reason why Caprivians in the caprivi strip of Namibia wanted to cut off the strip to become independent then merge with western Zambia…imwe ba ponono thats a dream western Zambian is infertile almost barren……Muzadya chani umuchanga….bafunika vikoti pamataka peka peka…
The issue of secession of Barotseland can be put to referendum which is scheduled for next year or the other year. We need to put this issue to rest once and for all otherwise some people will continue bringing this issue every now and then. In the referendum it will be clear that only maybe people in Mongu want to be ruled by the Litunga and so they can become an independent state if they want. We should not continue wasting time on this.
Kanyuya…i fail to understand your hatred….we were not there when the british gave Lewanika rights over the so called Barotseland. And we dont even know why lands like lesotho or swaziland were given similar status. Are you telling me all the people in those lands were consulted when agreements were being signed???
So if it were you ur tribe should have been the one that should have signed the agreement? i fail to reason with you your level of hatred is shocking me. You call it a scam…i think thats too shallow…why should the british allow the country to be a unitary state if it was a scam???? have you been to school or have you been educated well????
So when Lumwana was given for mining all the locals were consulted? let alone this Nickel mine here ? was there a referendum?
I dont really think now any meaningful Lozi wants to seceed , i guess what people want is an acknowledgement in the constitution that this thing existed and its provisions must stand for the rest of Zambias life. It was stupid for Musokotwani to even think people want to advocate secession and to talk about bounderies…thats not the point. All lozis are happy to be in the united Zambia what the bone of contention is the provisions let them continue and let the Agreement be respected.
The litunga and other members of the BRE were sitting on the NCC. Why didn’t they push for that agreement to be included in the draft constitution?
Kanguya walu swabisa – you are such a dissapointment to say the least, together with all of you ignorant contributors. Put it into your uninformed heads that without that agreement you would not have the Zambia you are talking about today. its better to keep quiet than post silly comments on this important issue. There were two territories under British administration – The Northern Rhodesia Colony and Barotseland Protectorate – and please not this – BAROTSELAND PROTECTORATE AND NOT COLONY that were brought under one Governor for administrative convenience only. That agreement was what brought them when Britain gave Independence to the Colony. The Prime Minister of Northern Rhodesia and the Litunga of Barotseland went to sign that agreement.
Now dont you think you are being unreasonable to rubbissh that agreement. And for your information the Litunga did not sign for himself but for the people of Barotseland and with their consent. if the people decide theyve had a raw deal no induna can silence them. They do not need the Blessings opf the BRE and that Induna was merely politicking. Other Indunas we have spoken to support the cause. The gathering wanted to have a peaceful meeting but the police went to provoke them by teargassing them and shooting live bullets at them. All they did was defend themselves. Its a pity some hooligans like Kanguya took advantage and damaged other people’s property. That is really regretable but the purpose of the meeting was to discuss that agreement and that is a constitutional right.
Government publish the Barotseland Agreement of 1964 so that we make well informed decisions. To say the least the approach (violence) being used by those advocating for restoration of the Agreement is non progressive
BRE surely you can do better than that for your people…………….Bulozi boote bu bata tuso ku mina, mu lu hauhele Litunga………………mangwe oooooosho……mangwe ooooooosho.